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Post by pilgrimmeister on Apr 11, 2021 23:59:58 GMT
I think now, more and more women with the Tinder culture especially if they are desirable typically branch from one relationship to the other, while emotionally ending the current one some time ago but not leaving them until there is a better option. What I am advocating is to just become an option for them and leave it at that (so they can view your insta, Snapchat etc at their leisure). However I would agree not to pursue them past that point if they make it clear that they have a boyfriend. But if like you, you chose to not get involved with monkey branchers, that totally fine, you just reduce the dating pool and filter out the needy ones. And with that last point it’s important to figure out what you might want with this person. If a LTR is what you’re seeking, you might be barking up the wrong tree. Needy begets needy. If her feeling “bored” is enough for her to decide she will put herself in a situation she can’t say no to, is this the sort of person you want to build something with...as at some point she will likely experience the same with you, and you’ll be constantly wondering what she’s doing on her phone... That's true, there are just so many at it, and yeah, you'd constantly have to keep things fresh and exciting all of the time. In the last few years alone, I have seen plenty of friends of mine get married and have kids, then after a few years, they became a family man stuck in that family routine, while their wives were no longer kept on their toes, got bored and were no longer attracted to their husbands, and once a more exciting option came along, kicked their husbands out, and got with the hunk at the office that very same night. I can count 5 coupes alone that I knew personally in the last 2 years it's happened to. The point I made to those is that because they changed and became more responsible, they were no longer this mysterious man anymore to them, and in this day and age, its too easy to switch and walk away, as with the Tinder generation, there are so many other options for women out there. Some of them who are single are often out of abusive relationships and need time to rebuild, and have underlying issues as a result, so are not desirable, no matter what they look like. Yeah, some guys will take them on, but at some stage, they will move onto better options once they become available to her, after that guy has given her the confidence and assurance that her ex never gave her. Other single types are longer term. Again they are not attractive or their lives are just too busy to fit a guy into their schedule, unless its an occasional FWB arrangement. They are out there, but catching a desirable woman, who is freely single, for LTR purposes is a lottery, and is why for some guys, if they advertise themselves as a better option than what they have, so they move into them is why they do it. There is always usually other guys involved anyway in some shape or form, so you are still competing. If there isn't competition from other guys, then alarm bells should be ringing. I had a girl who was speaking to me from a match online, where I figure out she is a dv victim with issues and emotional problems and it's put me off her, after spilling out all her issues after a few texts. Been single for a while, attractive but she isn't right. If she was desirable, there would be more competition. Same goes for women who typically won't touch men who haven't had any for a while, they usually go for men other women are after, or those in failing relationships. |
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Post by N2thevoid on Apr 12, 2021 3:21:27 GMT
^"The point I made to those is that because they changed and became more responsible, they were no longer this mysterious man anymore to them, and in this day and age, its too easy to switch and walk away, as with the Tinder generation, there are so many other options for women out there."
Nope. It's because these guys foreclosed on themselves. They stopped taking care of themselves and their needs. Having kids is no excuse, it's the whole oxygen mask on an airplane analogy. It's no diff for some of my male clients in marriages. They are doing the same shit when they sell the wives fall-off or realize how she's doesn't put her own needs first. If you aren't taking care of you, you are in no position to really take care of others. These men stop putting themselves first, and that's where they failed.
If you're worried of your woman veering to another, it's more telling about you and why you're attracting such women OR it just maybe that you need to work on your own insecurities.
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oneoff
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Post by oneoff on Apr 12, 2021 3:34:51 GMT
I don't mind girls with boyfriends. I draw the line at marriage though. The boyfriend situation is basically a lot of attractive women have boyfriends and if she's willing to still look at other options that cool. My dating philosophy is along the lines of what you find black dragon writing about in his audiobooks the unchained man which is essentially open relationships, pure freedom and choice.
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oneoff
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Post by oneoff on Apr 12, 2021 3:42:39 GMT
OP - as far as the situation you mentioned, seems like she's keeping you around for the validation so you have to turn the tables on her and get her seeking your validation. Right now she's in a higher position of power than you in the dynamic. Just building attraction with her isn't going to be enough. You need to flip the script because you've been alone with her it seems several times and nothing happened. She's extremely comfortable with you, but she doesn't view you as a sexual threat to her, and she knows you like her based on the behaviors you've told me about so far.
And she made it clear to you that she has a boyfriend, and you still come around orbiting. She has all of the cards. You're stuck in a certain reality and in order to get out of this you have to do a bit of reality smashing.
Strip her of all of this fucking validation and create a vacuum to get her to start chasing your approval. Not in a mean way but the frame needs to shift from beta orbiter to ceo-employee or teacher-student or something where you have the authority in the dynamic.
Once you reach that place then you can start introducing more sexual intent and begin to bait her into chasing that.
From there it's easy. But you can't go from 0-100 where you are to just going crazy showing sexual intent. It'll probably creep her the fuck out because you're not behaving in the expected box she put you in. Instead you transition from one stage, into the next.
It woulda been best if you never got here in the first place, but it is what it is.
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Post by curtis72 on Apr 13, 2021 11:54:12 GMT
OP - as far as the situation you mentioned, seems like she's keeping you around for the validation so you have to turn the tables on her and get her seeking your validation. Right now she's in a higher position of power than you in the dynamic. Just building attraction with her isn't going to be enough. You need to flip the script because you've been alone with her it seems several times and nothing happened. She's extremely comfortable with you, but she doesn't view you as a sexual threat to her, and she knows you like her based on the behaviors you've told me about so far. And she made it clear to you that she has a boyfriend, and you still come around orbiting. She has all of the cards. You're stuck in a certain reality and in order to get out of this you have to do a bit of reality smashing. Strip her of all of this fucking validation and create a vacuum to get her to start chasing your approval. Not in a mean way but the frame needs to shift from beta orbiter to ceo-employee or teacher-student or something where you have the authority in the dynamic. Once you reach that place then you can start introducing more sexual intent and begin to bait her into chasing that. From there it's easy. But you can't go from 0-100 where you are to just going crazy showing sexual intent. It'll probably creep her the fuck out because you're not behaving in the expected box she put you in. Instead you transition from one stage, into the next. It woulda been best if you never got here in the first place, but it is what it is. How do you suggest OP flips the switch and changes the dynamic? I'm sure he'd rather have the power in the interactions, but what precisely do you recommend? |
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oneoff
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Post by oneoff on Apr 20, 2021 17:10:04 GMT
You mean like techniques, and step by step instructions? I'd be sitting here typing all day. There are some good suggestions online and in books. You have to do it in a way where you're stretching rapport but not severing it with them entirely. That's the balance you have to strike.
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Post by curtis72 on Apr 21, 2021 10:37:29 GMT
You mean like techniques, and step by step instructions? I'd be sitting here typing all day. There are some good suggestions online and in books. You have to do it in a way where you're stretching rapport but not severing it with them entirely. That's the balance you have to strike. It's more that just saying "flip the dynamic" is similar to "just be confident", as it's very vague. Everyone would prefer to have the power in their interactions, but they don't and the obvious reason is because they can't. |
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Post by GFRESH2DEF on May 24, 2021 8:11:07 GMT
Hello. I am a newbie from Hong Kong. I am stuck in the friend zone with a girl for quite a while. Is there still any chance to get out of it? If yes, how? There used to be a few IoIs on a couple of occasions, but I missed the chances. Here are the best ways, to get out of the friend zone with a girl. This is just my opinion. And some of it, is from my experience too.
The Social Proof Game
Use social proof at the social gathering, that you and this girl are at. And that has to involve, another girl or other girls around you, that are talking to you..while this girl (the girl who put you into the friend zone) is there. It's important for you to make these girls feel good being around you (this is where your game comes into play). Because if these girls don't look like they're having fun talking to you..it will be a DLV (Demonstration of Low Value) in the girl's eyes. But if she sees that these girls are having a good time interacting with you..it will be a DHV (Demonstration of High Value) in the girl's eyes. You can also ignore her, while you're interacting with these other girls..to get the girl who has you in the friend zone, to chase you for her attention (so that you'll pay attention to her, instead of to those other girls). Btw..don't even look at her, while you're ignoring her. Why??..because even looking back at her, you're giving her the attention and validation that she will be chasing you for. So don't even look lol. I feel like the whole "don't even look at her" part, isn't talked about enough. If you can get these other girls, to touch you, or even makeout with you too..that's even better! And that will make her even more jealous. And when she's in a jealous state like that..that means she has attraction for you. Guys that don't know about female psychology, think that when they make a chick angry out of jealousy..it's a bad thing. No it's not! It's a very good thing! Because the whole point of you doing all of this to her..is so she can feel some attraction for you (feelings for you, that are more than just friendly feelings)..and she can see you in a different way (as more than friends). And if you think that's mean to do that to a girl..then just ask yourself this.. "Is it nice, that she put you into the friend zone?". The answer is "No!". And after that..ask yourself this question too.. "If she was the one who had a crush on you..do you think that she would like it, if you put her into the friend zone?". And the answer to that one is "No" also. Trust me..no one wants to be put into the friend zone..NO ONE! Bro, girls are ruthless..they will have no sympathy or shame in their game, when they put a guy into their friend zone. So you can't afford her any sympathy either. Nice guys finish last in this game. Once she's at the point when she's so starved for your validation and attention, that she's physically touching you..just grab her and makeout with her (she'll most likely kiss you back). And you can get as sexual with her as you like (escalate), with your kino. Just make sure that you are the one who pulls out of the kisses first, and she's the one going in for more. Then lead her back to her place or your place, and f-close her. Keep in mind that, if she is an attractive girl..she can also use those same social proof and jealousy tactics on you too. Because it's more than likely that guys will be trying to interact with her too. But it will be hard for her to resist chasing your attention and validation..especially if she sees that you're getting it from other girls, that are as hot as she is, or hotter. The Pre-Selection AngleThe next best thing is, the Pre-Selection angle. You don't actually have to have a girl there with you (for social proof)..but you do need to be banging other girls in private. She will just feel that confidence oozing off of you. And she will think that you must have other women that you are sleeping with. And as we all should already know..women like guys that other women already want. That's just the facts. This is why when guys are already in a relationship..women seem to want them more. And when you are single..women seem to want you less. You can briefly mention some other attractive girl (or girls) that you are seeing. Or you can show her one of those girl's picture (on social media or a dating app..wherever her picture is posted). But you can't just do it out of nowhere..because it will come across to her, as you bragging (Like you're trying to qualify yourself to her. Which puts her up on a pedestal above you). And that will be a DLV to her. You're not going to get her that way, because if you do that..she will know that she is above you (she will know that she is better than you)..because that's what you communicated to her, when you were qualifying yourself to her, with your bragging. Rather do it in a smooth way, that's in the flow of the conversation. Meaning..if she asks you if you are dating someone, then you can mention this girl or these girls that you are seeing. If you do it like that..it will be a DHV to her. And if she sees that you have these other girls that you are dating (fucking)..she may start seeing you differently (she may start viewing you, in a sexual light), and start flirting with you. And from there..you just run your normal game on her, as you did with any other girl, that you've hooked up with. The Self-Improvement Angle
The next best thing is, to just leave the friendship where it is..but just keep improving on yourself (go to the gym, and get fit..lose some weight..make some money..get better style/fashion..make more friends..etc..) in the meantime. If she sees that your life is improving..she may just start to see you, as higher value than how she saw you before. I remember back in my college days..there was a girl that i really wanted (she was a part of my circle, but she had a boyfriend at the time). She had classes with me, and we both lived on campus too. She was cute, and she had that body type, THAT I REALLY LIKE!  But i think she always viewed me as a nerd or something. So she kinda ignored me whenever i was around her. Or if she did talk to me..she would keep it short. So obviously "i wasn't her type". I remember i got real ill one week. I don't know what was wrong with me..but i had dizziness and shortness of breath that week. I think that i had really bad anxiety, because i was really stressed-out from the workload. So i had to take some time off from college, to go back home and recover. During that time period (about a couple of months)..i changed my diet..i exercised..i put on some weight (i was real skinny prior to that)..and i bought some new clothes (i improved my style and fashion a little bit too). Once my health was good again..i went back to college. And guess who was one of the first girls who greeted me, when i came back? Yes..it was her. She was giving me clear IOI's. And strangely..we started hanging out with each other alot. We hooked up, and had sex, not too long after that. And i was out of her "friend zone". So that was the "self-improvement angle", that i used to get out of the friend zone with her. But it's very important to note that..i didn't improve like that for her..i did it for myself. She just happened to really like the improvements that i made on myself (this was years before i got into pickup btw). I improved alot since she last saw me (my physical looks and style/fashion especially..that's the improvements that she was looking at specifically). And she started to see me as very attractive. And from there..she was chasing me. The Absolute Best Way To Get Out Of The Friend ZoneIn my opinion..the best way to get out of the friend zone..is to never get in it, in the first place! And you do that, by not accepting friendship from a girl that you are physically/sexually attracted to. You two can be acquaintances, sure. But the problem happens when the two of you, start hanging out together all the time, like you're buddies. Hang out with your guy friends like buddies, not with an attractive woman like she's your buddy. It almost never works out. All you'll be doing is, subjugating yourself to torture. You may be cool with that arrangement at first..but what happens when the day comes, that she starts flirting with other guys, while you're at that venue with her? What happens when she makes out with one of these guys, in front of you? How will you feel about your arrangement then? Or how about, when she ditches you for a random guy? And later on..you find out that, she's drunk and at this dude's house..when you call her, to find out where she's at..and she answers the phone, and tells you that she's going to sleep over there, at his house. How will you feel about your arrangement with her then? Not so fun huh? So you see..you never want to accept the whole "Let's just be friends" speech, from a girl that you're physically/sexually attracted to. Do not even pick up a girl, who just wants to be friends with you. Let her know what it is from the jump, and if she doesn't accept it..just move on..and it's on to the next girl. And the next girl, needs to be a girl that won't put you into the friend zone. She knows what you want from her, and that's what she wants from you too. No exceptions! Your time and energy is very valuable. Don't just give it to some girl, who's probably going to waste it..and use you for it. Because that's exactly what's going to happen. She's going to keep the pussy from you (because you guys are friends), and dangle it over your head..while you watch other guys get it. Trust me..you don't want to be that guy. It's a very painful and humiliating position to be in. And she won't even respect you for it anyways, if she sees that you're willing to put yourself into her friend zone. -G |
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Wacker
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Post by Wacker on Jun 3, 2021 11:21:29 GMT
Instead of trying to attract her or show her how much better you are than her current bf. Treat her like a friend. And just a friend. Pat her on the back like you would a friend while flirting with all her friends in front of her. Treat her like she is in the friendzone herself. This will get her chasing. Also dont ever try to tell her that her boyfriend is bad. Even if she is on your side because she will start to justify to herself why she is with him and will think of only the good memories. What you should rather do is talk about him like he is super great as if that it is normal for ALL guys to treat their gf that way. As if its normal for guys to be super great. Say things like, "hes been taking you up to watch sunsets regularly. Right? What, he hasnt. Thats too bad". Going about it this way is so much less needy compared to saying "hes the worst, and im way better!". Basically you are making her think negatively about him. Making her think "is my current bf as great as i think?" .
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Post by spicybisket on Nov 24, 2021 20:00:27 GMT
Hello. I am a newbie from Hong Kong. I am stuck in the friend zone with a girl for quite a while. Is there still any chance to get out of it? If yes, how? There used to be a few IoIs on a couple of occasions, but I missed the chances. Dude just move on. Its rude to other girls you can be dating 😃 |
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But i think she always viewed me as a nerd or something. So she kinda ignored me whenever i was around her. Or if she did talk to me..she would keep it short. So obviously "i wasn't her type". I remember i got real ill one week. I don't know what was wrong with me..but i had dizziness and shortness of breath that week. I think that i had really bad anxiety, because i was really stressed-out from the workload. So i had to take some time off from college, to go back home and recover. During that time period (about a couple of months)..i changed my diet..i exercised..i put on some weight (i was real skinny prior to that)..and i bought some new clothes (i improved my style and fashion a little bit too). Once my health was good again..i went back to college. And guess who was one of the first girls who greeted me, when i came back? Yes..it was her. She was giving me clear IOI's. And strangely..we started hanging out with each other alot. We hooked up, and had sex, not too long after that. And i was out of her "friend zone". So that was the "self-improvement angle", that i used to get out of the friend zone with her. But it's very important to note that..i didn't improve like that for her..i did it for myself. She just happened to really like the improvements that i made on myself (this was years before i got into pickup btw). I improved alot since she last saw me (my physical looks and style/fashion especially..that's the improvements that she was looking at specifically). And she started to see me as very attractive. And from there..she was chasing me.